We Are Our Stories

If you could choose, what would be the plot of the movie of your life? A Marvel Comic inspired semi-epic? Probably not. A laugh a minute Shakespearean comedy of errors? Not likely.

Jane’s words would make for an inspiring film. We’d be moved by her clear and stirring depiction of family. She  own journey  embodies the form of a stirring bildungsroman (a story about growing up).  She develops the kind of character traits early on that few do in the course of lifetime.  The formation of a strong and ethical character who chooses a challenging path to move forward in life while returning to her roots too could be pitched to a Hollywood producer. Jane’s carefully crafted sentences just might make a movie mogul try to turn the story of her life into a blockbuster. Or they may encourage you to create your own award winning life story.

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Can you tell us a bit about your family and where you grew up?

My parents and I all had very humble upbringings, so hard work and sacrifice, to me, seemed like normal, necessary aspects of life.

Both my parents are of Chinese ancestry but were born and raised in Vietnam. Their grandparents were born in China, but fled to Vietnam when they were young to escape communist China. My parents, in turn, left communist Vietnam for the same reasons after the war diminished their prospects of establishing a prosperous life there. My dad grew up in the poverty-stricken Vietnam countryside, where his father earned a meager living as a soldier during the Vietnam War on the U.S. side. He tells me stories all the time about how his father would be paid at the beginning of the month, but everything would be drained halfway through the month. So, for the second half of each month his family of 10 people would have nothing to subsist on except steamed rice with not a drop of soy sauce to be had. After the communists took over, his family’s reputation as U.S. sympathizers precluded any chances of obtaining jobs in the communist state. My dad wanted to become a teacher in Vietnam, but that was impossible given the circumstances. So in 1978, my dad – along with 60 other people – crammed onto a single 4”x16” wooden boat headed to Malaysia. The boat ran out of fuel after the first day at sea, so the passengers had no choice but to float hopelessly adrift in the Indian Ocean. That first night after running out of fuel, the little boat passed through a thunderstorm and was rocked by huge waves the height of one- or two-story homes, according to my dad. The storm passed within a half day or so, but my dad and his fellow passengers were hysterical and thought they were done for. By mid-day on the second day at sea, a large British vessel came toward them, asked how many people were on the boat, and kindly bestowed upon the refugees fuel, food, water, and directions to Malaysia, where they arrived after three days and four horrifying nights at sea on that tiny crammed boat. After he and his fellow refugees arrived in Malaysia, where he arrived with just one spare change of clothes, he went to the forest every day for eight months to chop and gather wood to sell as a means of survival. One day, he saw his name on a list of refugees who would be transported to the U.S. (he was given three to four weeks’ notice). He was transported to Seattle (a check-in point) to do some paperwork before arriving in Arlington, Virginia.

But his struggles didn’t end with his departure from Asia. My dad went to school at Wakefield High School in Arlington to learn English for about a year before going to school at Northern Virginia Community College. After work in high school and at NVCC, my dad walked 35 minutes – rain, snow, or sunshine – for his daily 5-11 p.m. shift as a busboy (he eventually became a waiter and bartender there in his youth). Though he was barely getting by, he still managed to save up money to pay back the U.S. government for his one-way ticket to the U.S., and consistently sent a portion of his minimum-wage earnings back to Vietnam to support 10 family members (his parents and siblings).

My mom arrived in the U.S. on May 11, 1980.  She was a Chinese language teacher in Vietnam but left to join her older brother, who had arrived in Northern Virginia a few years prior, because she knew she had “no future” in Vietnam. My mom and dad met in the fall of 1980 and married the following year.

I grew up in Alexandria, Virginia, where I still live today. I was a proud product of the Fairfax County school system.

Jane 

 You attended a secondary school, J.E.B. Stuart High School, in Virginia, that offers the IB (International Baccalaureate). Some people think this program is among the best preparation for success in college, but that it is very time intensive. Can you talk about your experience with the IB and if you think more schools should incorporate this program into their school systems?

I am so glad my classmate and dear friend encouraged me to join the IB diploma program halfway through my junior year in high school because it completely changed the trajectory of my life! The IB program pushed me to work more diligently than I knew I was capable of, and this work ethic is something that I have carried with me throughout life since then. The IB program definitely helped me transition from high school to college because it forced me to find an effective study method that helped me be successful in school, and taught me to focus and analyze rather than performing rote memorization. I’m not sure why more schools haven’t adopted the IB program because many students like me have very clearly benefitted from it.

How much stress were you under to perform well in your school and to get accepted to highly selective universities? Was this stress internal or was there a lot of stress coming form other sources? For example, how much of a role do you think the media and rankings play in the lives of students and families? Is this unhealthy?

I was good at managing my time so I don’t remember getting stressed out too often, but that is not to say I wasn’t ever nervous, extremely busy, or tired. I remember having a very heavy workload – especially in my junior and senior years in high school. It got to the point where I was doing school reading and homework from the time I got home from school until bedtime with just two breaks: for dinner and a shower. I hardly had any free time to spend with my darling pet bunny! I was not concerned about being admitted by highly selective universities – not because I was confident about my admission prospects but rather because I was more focused on being a good student in whatever classes I was enrolled in at the time. In general, I think that’s how I approach most things in life: I try to do my best in whatever situation I find myself in – even if the end goal is a bit hazy – that way you can’t preclude yourself from any opportunity that lands in your lap in the future.

In retrospect, I was probably too focused on setting the curve in my high-school classes, but I wouldn’t be where I am now if I hadn’t been so driven during those years. The pressure to excel in school was internal because doing well in school gave me confidence and peace of mind. The better I performed in high school, the more attention I got from my parents, and the more they pushed me to go even further. Thinking about this question more, I think what motivates me to excel in school and now at work is the fear of struggling. Struggling is a very uncomfortable feeling for anybody, so any degree of understanding gives me peace of mind.

Jane volunteering for PFAN, a multicultural  peer mentoring program that helps incoming Asian/Asian Pacific American students with their transition into college

How do you decide which schools to apply to and which one to enroll in?

Some people might be surprised that I only applied to four colleges because I was almost certain I would ultimately go to school closer to home because that’s what my parents wanted me to do. I applied to three D.C.-area schools, and U.Va. Even though I applied to U.Va, I never seriously considered matriculating there – even though I was well aware of the school’s excellent reputation – until I was accepted, and after I’d received a home phone call from Admissions Dean Roberts, who wanted to know if I had any questions about U.Va, shortly after I’d received my U.Va acceptance letter in the mail.

You were accepted to an elite honors program within a highly selective school. Can you describe the Rodman Scholars program and what was special about it?

Rodman Scholars are a remarkable group of students. The Rodman Scholars in my class all seemed very mature, motivated, and intrinsically intelligent. It was very inspiring to me to be a part of that group, and I am honored to have been one. Some of my favorite parts of the program are the one-credit RodSems, which are fun Rodman-only electives we wouldn’t normally be able to take because of enrollment restrictions, etc. There is a very popular fourth-year beer brewing class, but my favorite RodSems were the mindfulness and photography classes.

There is also a sense of community that is very unique to the Rodman Scholars program that we don’t see quite so much of in, say, the comparable Echols Scholars program in the College of Arts & Sciences, even though both types of students are grouped in the same first-year dorms. Rodman Scholars who befriend each other during their first-year at U.Va generally remain great friends throughout college and beyond. I think there is something about the very challenging first-year engineering classes that really helped bind us together because we shared mutual struggles and periods of self-doubt – the kind of moments that breed familiarity and friendship.

What was it that drew you to engineering and why did you decide to concentrate on chemical engineering and applied mathematics? Did you ever feel that being a woman in engineering was a disadvantage in any way? Did you ever have to fight against any stereotypes? Did you ever feel it was advantageous in any way to be a female engineer? Did you have any mentors who helped you academically or otherwise? Are there classes that had a significant impact on what you wanted to do after graduation?

Math had always been a strong subject for me, so engineering seemed like a natural progression. At one point I seriously considered becoming a math teacher. I was good at math because I practiced a lot. That is, whenever I got a problem wrong on a homework or practice exam, I would do the problem again and again until I got it exactly right. I remember the day I decided I wanted to become an engineer: during my junior year in high school, the women in my IB Physics class were required to attend an assembly hosted by two MIT students who sought to encourage more females to study engineering. I wasn’t interested in engineering at the time and so escaped and joined the gentlemen in the adjoining classroom until my physics teacher found me and sent me across the hall to join the other female students at the assembly. Even though I didn’t attend the assembly by choice, I was inspired!

My mom saw a photo of me with my engineering design group a few months ago and asked me if the five gentlemen in my group ever treated me differently because I was the lone female. To be honest, I’d never considered that in my 10 months of working closely with the group. The truth is, I’d never felt different, nor had I ever been treated differently. I treated my teammates with respect and earned theirs by being a contributing team member. Three of us actually became really good friends after getting to know each other during this past school year.

As for mentors, teachers are among my favorite people. My teachers who were kind enough to reach out to me have shaped who I’ve become for the better. I still keep in touch with my favorite teachers from high school, but since this question is about university: Dr. James Groves was my technical advisor for my senior technical thesis in my multidisciplinary engineering design course, and was an invaluable resource in guiding our project. Likewise, Prof. Kay Neeley is one of the most intelligent and articulate women I have ever met, and I am so glad to have been her student and STS research paper advisee because she is hugely inspirational to me.

Jeff Holt is an amazing U.Va math professor. His Number Theory class reminded me of the striking beauty of math with real-word, non-engineering applications. I also seriously considered becoming an actuary after taking his Derivatives and Securities class.

Jane on top of the world (Humpback Rock) in her Cavalier Daily shirt

You were also busy out of class, not something that is all that easy for an engineering student. You rose to become one of the Executive Editors of one of the top students newspapers in the country. Can you describe your various roles with the Cavalier Daily and can you say whether you learned skills there that you use in your job now? How did you balance the huge workload both in classes and with the CD?

I joined The Cavalier Daily in September of my first year at U.Va in 2008. I started off as a staff writer, became a news associate that December covering the Student Council beat, was elected to become the Special Projects / Focus editor for the paper’s investigative arm in January 2010, and became the Executive Editor that September. I credit my time with The Cavalier Daily for helping me come out of my shell and introducing me to people who became some of my best friends. Balancing school and newspaper commitments required excellent time management, but it was entirely worthwhile, I think. I was successful at The Cavalier Daily because I was constantly scoping out interesting story ideas and topics to investigate and report on – both for myself and for other staff members – and I was a reliable staff member that my editors could depend on. My news stories were always complete, balanced, delivered on time, and required minimal editing – all factors that are important for deadline-driven news publications. Some of the skills I learned during my time with the newspaper were dealing with people and navigating situations with at-times prickly personalities – something any working adult must practice at work J.

You are a leader in what you did as a student and now in your profession too. Can you describe a bit what the WLDP program is and what you did with it?  What makes someone a good leader?

The Women’s Leadership Development Program (WLDP) is a program for first- and second-year and transfer students who have been identified by professors and other university leaders for demonstrating leadership potential. Basically, the program is a multi-week sequence of conferences, each with a theme that seeks to instill some sort of lesson to help usher these women with the tools to become the future leaders of the University and the world. WLDP focuses on skills such as networking, delivering an elevator pitch, etc. After being a first-year participant and then executive board member, I was so honored to have been invited back to speak on a women’s leadership panel about my experience as a student leader at the university during my four years. I was also invited in 2011 to speak to U.Va’s resident advisors on a multicultural leadership panel by one of the co-chairs during their summer training camp, but could not attend due to prior commitments.

As for what makes someone a good leader, the quote that best describes this in my experience working with and for both capable and incompetent leaders or managers is from Sheryl Sandberg’s Lean In: “Leadership is about making others better as a result of your presence and making sure that impact lasts in your absence.” Another quote I heard recently from my current work client and then again by a training instructor is that good leaders do not hoard knowledge; people who hoard knowledge are impediments to business processes.

Jane facing the job search (actually visiting the Ohio State University Dinosaur Museum)

How did you go about the job search? Did you know what you wanted to do or were you open to many options? How useful was career services?

I have rather varied interests, as anyone could glean from my varied activities while in college, so I wasn’t sure what I kind of job I wanted to pursue after college. Fortunately, two of my old Cavalier Daily friends – Irene Kan (CLAS ’10) and Laura Dada (nee Hoffman, CLAS ’09) – were trying to fill a position in their Bids & Proposals department at a company called M.C. Dean, and thought I would be perfect for the job. I interviewed there shortly afterwards and got the job. Having two automatic friends at my first job was fantastic because they were my mentors during their time with the company. It is a real luxury to work with people I know I can trust – especially in such a stressful work environment – because we often helped each other when it was clear one of us needed a reliable helping hand to bring our assignments to completion.

I did not use U.Va’s career resources, but they did a lot of excellent outreach and programming from what I could tell.

You obtained a great position as a Proposal Manager at MC Dean a great firm in Northern Virginia. You ended up helped to win billion dollar contracts and served as a mentor and leader. Can you give us some idea of what you did day to day and if it was what you expected? Did you feel your engineering training combined with your journalistic background set you apart from your peers since this is a rare combination? What do you think you learned about yourself during your years there?

My three years at M.C. Dean were as formidable as my years in college; I’d matured both personally and professionally there. Working in bids and proposals is a very high-stress, high-stakes job, and I can’t believe how much responsibility companies unload on such young proposal managers. My engineering and journalistic backgrounds were qualities that my hiring managers really appreciated because I am a very analytical, process-oriented thinker who can also develop a coherent, multi-component proposal, but I think there are many types of people from different backgrounds who can and have succeeded in that type of job. Looking back, I’m so, so proud of the way I was able to handle the pressure of juggling multiple high-pressure assignments with staggered deadlines, the long nights, working weekends, and unexpected all-nighters. My time there surprised me by showing me that I am capable of much more than I give myself credit for.

In August of 2105 you left MC Dean and returned to Uva for engineering design. What motivated you to make this change? Can you describe your success in the Engineering Science Research and Design Symposium Entrepreneurship Cup?

I left M.C. Dean in August 2015 after three years of service because by that point I was already working on the company’s most complex proposals and I had learned everything the company could have taught me, so I knew it was time to move on. I was only 25 years old at the time – much too young to stop learning, so it was time to start something new. I knew deep down I needed to move on even though the thought of doing so was intimidating. I’d made real friends at M.C. Dean so I felt the tug of loyalty that made it hard to leave. It was a hard decision, but I never doubted that it was the correct one. I still get emails from old colleagues asking me if I’m ready to come back yet J.

At U.Va, my engineering design team’s success in the school’s prestigious engineering, science, and research symposiums was unexpected because competing engineering design teams were quite exceptional, but the experience was incredible. One of the best outcomes of that experience was being able to get outside perspectives from fellow entrepreneurs and subject matter experts that helped shape our work. More generally, the experience helped me better understand the design process, which is still applicable to my career even though it’s not engineering-related. Ultimately, it all boils down to value to the customer.

Jane getting a helping hand

What does it take to work well in groups?

Group work is a fact of life; it’s inescapable so everyone ought to learn how to do it well. Working well in groups requires good coordination, clear delineation of roles and responsibilities, patience, active listening, and self-awareness of everyone’s strengths and weaknesses. Some group activities in school, work, and life are more challenging and stressful than others, but it gets easier with practice. The actual work might be doable, but the people and personalities might be the real challenge. It also helps to identify when conflict begins to brew in a group because people need to diffuse that type of conflict before group morale takes a nosedive. It’s nearly impossible to recover if things reach that point so it’s best to prevent it, if possible. The most cohesive groups I’ve been a part of have a few things in common: some level of accountability for all group members, and mutual respect that comes from delivering quality contributions in a timely manner. Everyone has different skillsets – even at the same company, school, or major – but if everyone feels like they have something to bring to the table, or are acknowledged for bringing all that they are able to present, then that is good enough. Genuine effort does not go unnoticed

How should people think about being able to contribute well in groups and yet to be a leader too?   What skill sets do people need who would like to pursue some of the things you have?

I don’t think anybody can be a good leader without also being a good team member. Good leaders need to consider two things: the actual task that is to be accomplished, and the team dynamic. As with everyone else, I am still learning as I go, but while it is important to make sure everyone is held accountable for the project, a productive team is a happy, functioning one. Work quality will inevitably be poor if group morale is low, so that is always something to look out for.

As for what it might take for someone to pursue the things I have, I don’t think there is a set path necessarily, but the best way for anyone to prepare himself or herself for the next opportunity is to excel in their current position.

You have now been working as a consultant at Booz Allen and Hamilton for several months. Why did you decide to transition to consulting and has it been, so far, what you expected? What are the skill sets you need to succeed at a firm like Booz Allen Hamilton?

The transition into consulting has been smoother than I had anticipated – especially with years of proposal management and school engineering activities behind me – although that is not to say my job is easy. My assignments increase in complexity each week as I become more comfortable with new skills and learn new tricks, but I am enjoying the journey so far. I give lots of credit to my amazing career manager and the other project managers on my team who have been my big supporters during the past few months.

As with any company, hiring decisions are based on performance potential, so any shred of proven performance and success in school or previous/current employment is evidence in any job candidate’s favor.

Jane with Tim Kaine 

You represent, in many ways, the multiple paths that highly motivated people take as their approach to their careers now. They are willing to transition to different kinds of jobs and are willing to work to learn new skills-- both soft and hard. Do you feel that this transitioning across rather than simply down in terms of jobs is empowering? Do you think it is the way more people should approach their career path?

There is a Steve Harvey quote that sticks out to me:

“Your parachute will not open right away. You’re gonna hit them rocks. You can play it safe and deal without the cuts and tears. And you can stand on that cliff of life forever safe. But if you don’t jump, your parachute will never open.” – Steve Harvey

My varied background has always been viewed as a positive attribute to hiring managers, although I should note that none of that meandering was intentional. It can feel uncomfortable to start over in a completely different career in a completely different industry and to learn all the industry and company’s processes and get a feel for the new jargon, but that’s something everyone has to go through with each job change. Some of the most marketable skills, in my opinion, are quantitative or qualitative evidence that job candidates are trainable, adaptable, and reliable. Industries change, and one way to secure some degree of job security amidst that kind of uncertainty is to be adaptable.

What advice could you give to those who think that the path to success is linear? What have you learned about being nimble and open to change?

The human frontal cortex doesn’t finish developing until approximately age 25, so even fresh college grads, who are considered bona fide adults under the law, still have a few years of psychological maturity ahead of them. When I started working full-time, I was surprised by the variety of jobs that are out there; the number of people and roles required to keep a company of any size afloat is astonishing! Just like my high-school career counselor told all of us when we were trying to decide which college to commit to: a good job is not a prize to be won but a match to be made. Everyone – even those who grew up in the same school district, those who went to the same school, or even people in the same major of study – have different skill sets, strengths, weaknesses, and miscellaneous capacities, so it might take a few years of trial and error to find the right industry or job that you will thrive in. Sometimes it’s hard to determine whether or not something will be a good fit for you until you dive in.

I decided after leaving my job as a proposal manager to make the most of any opportunity that came my way, however scary that might be. Transitioning into a different career in a different industry has been smoother than expected, but it helps that I have more tools in my arsenal now that I have a few working years behind me. The point is there is a learning curve of varying sizes for any new job, but it’s probably better not to pigeonhole yourself for the sake of job security and marketability to some degree.

Jane and Fortune's Wheel

Where do you want to go in your career (and in life too if you are willing to share that too)?

I am looking forward to seeing where my current career path takes me, even though I don’t know exactly what or where that is. I don’t know what the future holds necessarily, but I will make the most of any opportunity that comes my way, the way I have always approached life. If that doesn’t work out, I can always fall back on my proposal management experience. After all, all companies need to win proposals and contracts to stay afloat. That wasn’t my intention when I started working as a proposal manager, but I am glad my circumstances turned out the way they did.

As for aspirations in life, I just purchased my first home – right across the street from my parents’ house! I look forward to one day raising a family in the same neighborhood I grew up in, and watching my children go to the same public schools I went to and walk over to my parents’ house after school – the way I spent many an afternoon at my grandparents’ house, just three houses down the street from where I grew up. I couldn’t turn down that kind of opportunity. 

Is there anything else you want to add?

The career trajectories of twenty-somethings (and probably beyond) can be especially tumultuous, uncertain, and perhaps fraught with periods of self-doubt, so, here are two quotes I try to keep in mind:

“There are years that ask questions and years that answer.” – Zora Neale Hurston in There Eyes Were Watching God

“The best way out is always through.” – Robert Frost

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Jane with her 5th grade classmates

The cliché about a hard act to follow seems far too superficial, but it’s the best I can come up with. Perhaps instead of reading any of my words you should go back to the beginning of this interview and read it all again. And again. I have and it’s worth every moment.

If Jane were the featured speaker at a conference of high level experts on the topics of education and career exploration then everyone lucky enough to pay the big bucks to attend and hear her would come away with wisdom that few of us could gain on our own. Jane’s smart, that’s easy enough to get pretty quickly, but she’s smart in the way that she need not try to impress. Her words are clear, clean, stones that skip across the neural pathways and in the circles that are left we find our intersecting minds. That’s too poetic a description perhaps; so let me put it another way. Jane has not given us a template for success, or the simple and simplistic self-help stuff that exists across all forms of media. Instead she give us details, about her upbringing,  her successes and also, underneath, a nearly unspoken truth:  how most of what serves as the foundation of her life so far is based on a willingness to work hard, that is combined with a desire to serve, and is all held together by an abiding respect and love for family and friends.

The report released early this year by Harvard, Turning the Tide Inspiring Concern for Others and the Common Good through College Admissions gathered the sup-ort of virtually every highly selective school in the land. As the title suggests, the way we have been pushing the students to succeed today has come at a cost. The report focuses on ways we can encourage students and young adults to turn outward from what has been called a culture of narcissism toward a more community based approach to learning and living. What some do not understand about the report and about the way the world works is that it does not say that any of us should not work hard t achieve our goals, but that these goals should include giving to others. Jane’s story demonstrates how as a leader and a mentor she has helped many in her various communities. She has also benefited form the values she has internalized from her family and friends, faculty and supervisors. In other words, she is the kind of person we need more of today. I would like to thank Jane for sharing her words to the community of my readers and to me. Her humility is genuine and all too rare these days. Although she is incredibly busy, she put a great deal of effort into her interview for no other reason than her wish to help. It is also obvious that Jane has a great future ahead of her.

I would also like to thank her parents for their courage and for giving her the tools to be an educated citizen, as Mr. Jefferson would say, who will continue to contribute to her communities and to our country.

"Every thought you produce, anything you say, any action you do, it bears your signature." Thich Nhat Hahn

                          Jane's graduation with her appropriately proud parents